 posted
December 27, 2001 12:33 PM 
   
Thomas Barriano wrote: Let's straighten
up this thing about "buddies". I met Fred Hassen once…I don't work for him, get
paid by him or have any contact with him, offline.
LC: Let’s face it Thomas you’re one of
his boosters who pop up when he can’t or won’t. You don’t need to be paid by him
to do that.
Thomas Barriano wrote: I've never met
Steve Leigh
LC: Another booster. Anyone who aligns
himself with Steve is of the same character that he is. “Birds of a feather.”
Thomas Barriano wrote: I do however
think his Frawley/Castle website is one of the funniest things on the Web
LC: It’s obvious that you’ve never made
the phone call that I request that people make to my department to verify a few
facts. Steve’s website makes all sorts of false allegations about me, Ed and
Donn that can easily be knocked into the toilet, where they belong, by simply
making that phone call.
Hold on there,
Voodoo. What would a call to your department have to do with LEERKOPF™
Frawley or Yarnell? What is YOUR department going to say about people who
they know nothing about, and aren't associated with YOUR department at all?
But why should you let the facts interfere with your
ability to make a decision? You’re name calling of me on the Edog list clearly
shows what kind of a person you are. And the fact that you’ve adopted Steve’s
“pet name” drives that home.
Thomas Barriano wrote: I've never
referred to either Fred or Steve as "an Eagle, pestered by a Gnat" or something
to that effect like Donn Y said about you recently.
LC: I’d suggest a course in critical
reading Thomas. Donn was talking about unimportant people pestering him. He
wasn’t talking about me. ROFL. Everyone on this board knows of Donn’s
qualifications and mine. And yours as well. LOL
Thomas Barriano wrote: I didn't hype
Fred's seminars, as the best thing since sex, like you did with Donn Y's
Guidance System Video.
LC: Hardly the best thing since sex
Thomas. But as far as dog training videos go, it’s pretty damn good. We had a
conversation about it but you were too thick to learn anything from either the
video or my details explanation of it.
Thomas Barriano wrote: Your stated goal,
has been to shut down the E-dog list. Your claim that you "just wanted to see
what they were saying about you" and that your "Sam" posts were "innocent and innoculous " is delusional, self serving BS!
When Voodoo Louie is
thrown off a list it doesn't really MEAN he's been thrown off a list.
Voodoo can sneak back on and make EXCUSES about moderators - and that justifies
everything. In HIS insane, delusional mind, anyway.
LC: The Edog list is run by a moderator
who is a “book burner” at best! Just like any other dictator he molds the words
of others to suit his own needs. He’s “edited” the archives so that anything
that he disagrees with has been removed. He, like you Thomas, is a Fred booster.
That means that no one is allowed to disagree with Fred.
That’s the real reason
I was removed.
Voodoo - the
REAL reason you were removed is RIGHT HERE.
Lie your way out of that, Voodoo-boy.
And the real reason that you keep after me. Don’t think it isn’t
obvious.
Thomas Barriano wrote: Now lets get to
the thing that started this whole situation: Your (and others) belief that Fred
shouldn't be doing Police Seminars because he isn't a cop.
LC: BULLSHIT. Thomas you haven’t read
anything that I’ve written except to fog it through your own desires and
perception. I’ve NEVER said that because Fred isn’t a cop he shouldn’t be
teaching cops. Others HAVE said that but I’ve never made such a statement.
LC: Fred shouldn’t be teaching SAR or
police dogs because he doesn’t even have a clue about drives or what makes dogs
do what dogs do. He also know nothing of scentwork. He’s told me several times
that he only believes in one drive, “The do it when I say do it drive.” That may
be fine for competition dogs that are pattern trained (which BTW is not EVERY
competition dog) but it doesn’t work for dogs that use their noses for a living.
If you’ll notice, Fred’s claim to fame is an OB title, more pattern training.
I’m not going to go back to square one with this but suffice it to say that
Fred’s methods can destroy the scent finding ability of a dog doing difficult
scent work. He wouldn’t know anything about that because he has never done
difficult scent work. And so, apparently neither have you.
Thomas Barriano wrote: We don't even
have to go to the obvious fact, that both you and Donn are in competetion with
Fred for the lucrative K9 Training Seminar market.
LC: ROFL. It’s always entertaining when
someone exposes his ignorance through his own writings. Thomas the “lucrative K9
Training Seminar market” that you refer to is ANYTHING but lucrative. Much of
the work is done for free as long as expenses are covered. I’ve volunteered, and
so have dozens of others, at quite a few seminars. I LOSE money at those. I have
to burn my own vacation time and board my dogs while I’m gone. Those expenses
aren't covered. I’m lucky to break even when I do get paid. Ain’t NOBODY getting
rich by doing SAR or PSD seminars. I do it for the feedback I get from those who
participate. I do it for the phone calls, private letters and emails I get from
people who have put the training to work and achieved some success. It’s a labor
of love, hardly a get–rich–quick–scheme. Private trainers like to work with
police or SAR because it adds to their prestige and credibility to have it on
their resume. Of course some are driven by their innate desire to help but
that’s not, and never has been, Fred’s motivation. He’s a salesman pure and
simple. Witness his refusal to answer even the most basic of questions on this
or any other board. Why should he, he’s not getting paid? The REAL money in dog
training is in pet dog work. Ask Fred why he used to habitually wear a Las Vegas
Metro K9 (the local Police Department) hat to all of his house calls?
LC: There are MILLIONS of pets in this
country. There are only a few hundred thousand SAR and PSD’s. Donn and I aren’t
even interested in The REAL Money except for a very few exceptions and those are
friends or friends of friends. I’ve worked with hundreds of SAR and PSD
handlers. I’ve got around 15 private clients, if that. It’s pretty obvious where
my sympathies lie. I’m headed out tonight to do some training with three local
departments. Guess how much I’ll be paid. If I’m lucky, they’ll buy me dinner.
That should just about cover my gas. Lucrative!!! Don’t make me laugh Thomas.
Thomas Barriano wrote: I don't speak for
Fred, but he doesn't claim to be a cop or know any thing about cop stuff. He has
never told any cop, how to deploy his dog or anything about cop >> tactics. He
knows and teaches E-collars.
LC: Well, Thomas guess what; you ARE
speaking for Fred right here. And since you aren’t present at his seminars, you
don’t have a clue as to what Fred is or isn’t saying to the officers at his
seminars. I know at least two officers who took Fred’s methods to use on their
own dogs. One dog began to balk so badly that he refused to leave his handler’s
side. Another dog wouldn’t stay on a bite for more than a few seconds. He’d drop
off and run to his handler, anticipating a correction. So Fred really doesn’t
have to say a word about police work to ruin a dog with his seminars. So even if
he doesn’t tell police officers how to deploy, he's capable of doing damage.
Thomas Barriano wrote: If the cops that
attend his seminars, weren't learning something, they could use, they would stop
going?
LC: How many officers do you know of who
have attended more than one of his seminars? At the Tucson Seminar that Fred
boasts of quite a bit, do you know that NOT ONE handler (and this was not the
first time that they’d seen Fred or his methods) volunteered to work their dogs?
Do you know that they had to obtain some dogs from the local pound so that Fred
could demonstrate what he does? Fred continually mentions ONE police officer
that has fallen for his nonsense. ONE. Donn or I could supply you with dozens of
names of K9 officers that we’ve worked with. But we’re not in the sales business
so we don’t need to. Also keep in mind that I’m not training dogs full time.
When I’m at work I’m a police officer, not a full time dog trainer, like Fred.
Donn has retired now but he still picks and chooses how far he goes and for how
long, based on spending time with his kids.
Thomas Barriano wrote: There are more
civilians training (not handling) K9's than cops. Every Schutzhund Club or
Seminar I've been to, has had working K9 officers there.
LC: Do you think that a K9 handler going
to a SchH club and giving his dog a few bites or working OB or doing some
obstacles constitutes "civilians doing police dog training? If so you’re
stupider than I thought. I used to attend one of those sessions quite regularly
when I was a handler. But the club trainer would NEVER have the temerity to say
that he was doing any police dog training. There’s obviously some overlap
between what PSD’s do and what sport dogs do. But for you to think that because
a SchH decoy takes a bite that he’s competent to train a PSD is beyond
ludicrous.
Thomas Barriano wrote: IMHO, cops (K9
and others) are like the rest of us, they learn from where ever they can, they
take the information that is applicable and leave the rest.
LC: I agree. But Fred methods can and
have caused damage to the working ability of PSD’s. He should stick to making
pets recall to their owners. You can keep on worshipping at the Fred altar if
you wish, and you probably will, but you really should have some idea of what
you’re talking about before you shoot off your mouth. It would really make it
more interesting.
LC: BTW thanks to Kelly and Paul for
their kind words and support.
--------------------
Regards
Lou Castle, Los Angeles, CA
(Uncllou@aol.com)
Posts: 109 | From: Los
Angeles, CA | Registered: Jul 2001 | IP: Logged
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HOLD ON! What about that fraudulent COPYRIGHT?
posted
December 11, 2001 10:41 PM 
